Mmmmm, you got 80,000 families a year being destroyed through the disfellowshipping practice alone. This does not include the thousands of families destroyed and lives taken from the blood policy or the lives destroyed by unreported pedophiles in the Watchtower Organization. They are also criminally responsible for countless suicides due to their teaching that a person can self-atone when they die.
Face it; The Watchtower organization started by Russell has been a sociological nuclear bomb unleashed on the human race. Our families just drew the short straw that's all.
I am also utterly shocked that ANY WT monuments still exist. There is good reason for GB members to have body guards wherever they go.
Sea Breeze
JoinedPosts by Sea Breeze
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54
Allegheny Pyramid Desecrated
by RolRod insometime within the last 2 weeks, someone took a sledgehammer to the pyramid monument in allegheny.
they stole the topstone, smashed the cross and crown emblem and removed the seal.. personally i'm surprised it lasted this long untouched.
although through the years russell's grave has been vandalized, it was always repaired by the bible students..
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Sea Breeze
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30
The Stupidity Of The Biden Administration Knows No Bounds
by Simon inso picture this, you are suddenly withdrawing troops after 2 decades in a country and, well, its all gone to shit.. how do you ensure that your vulnerable citizens and allies can get out when the airport is surrounded and no one can get through?.
option 1: it's a trick question surely?
you don't get yourself into this mess in the first place - you withdraw the citizens first, not last, duh!.
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Sea Breeze
We witnessed the slow "managed decline" of the USA under Obama where he went apology tours around the world and generally weakened the US in a number of ways on purpose.
We are witnessing more of the same. Biden knows what he is doing just as Obama did...they are not stupid.
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Sea Breeze
Mormon doctrine states that when the husband dies he must invite his wife into heaven or else she doesn't get saved.
Think about that for a minute.
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Pfizer becomes first Covid vaccine to gain full FDA approval
by PaddyTheBaddy ingreat news.. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58309254.
pfizer's two-dose covid-19 vaccine has received full approval from the us food and drug administration (fda) - the first jab to be licensed in the nation.. .
the vaccine had initially been given emergency use authorisation.
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Sea Breeze
I've heard this before; Two separate letters ONE FOR THE ELDERS AND ONE FOR THE PUBLISHERS.
And don't forget the two separate WT magazines.... one for the unsuspecting public and one for brain-dead drones at the KH.
Yes, we have seen it all before. -
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Pfizer becomes first Covid vaccine to gain full FDA approval
by PaddyTheBaddy ingreat news.. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58309254.
pfizer's two-dose covid-19 vaccine has received full approval from the us food and drug administration (fda) - the first jab to be licensed in the nation.. .
the vaccine had initially been given emergency use authorisation.
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17
What JWs don't know they believe
by StephaneLaliberte inin a post this morning, i suggested that a way to wake up fellow congregants is to plainly comment or make talks on teachings and rules the jws don't really know too well.
the idea is that you can say these things, other jws will be bothered by the comments, but will not be able to do anything about it as this is the official teaching or stand on this or that.
the key here is that when troubling rules and teachings are thought in the watchtower, they generally use wording that makes them go down easy.
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Sea Breeze
I'd like to solve the puzzle, Pat
I-T-S-A-C-U-L-T
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38
New Approach to Discussing Deity of Christ with JW's
by Sea Breeze in5:27; 9:59; 18:22; jn.
9:48; [21:8]; 24:47; jn.
21:12, 17;] jn.
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Sea Breeze
Rattigan350,
On the bottom of the original post on the first page of this thread, there is a link to a secret recording where this information is presented to a JW elder on a return visit starting at time marker 15:15.
It all really comes alive when presented in the context of a real conversation with a JW elder. I would have been devastated if I had been that JW. Can't wait for part 2 to be released to see how the encounter ends up..... probably next Sunday.
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New Approach to Discussing Deity of Christ with JW's
by Sea Breeze in5:27; 9:59; 18:22; jn.
9:48; [21:8]; 24:47; jn.
21:12, 17;] jn.
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Sea Breeze
Jeffo,
Dr. Habermas' lecture at the University of California Santa Barbara outlines the consensus of modern scholarship (including skeptic) today on many facts surrounding Jesus and the gospel accounts, which scholars trace to just months, or even weeks after being crucified.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOW7k3hQ-vE&ab_channel=FallenEmbersRoman governor Pliny the Younger (A.D 111-115): Roman governor Pliny the Younger mentioned in a letter to Emperor Trajan that early Christians would “sing hymns to Christ as to a god.” (Latin, carmenque christo quasi deo; Pliny, Epistles 10.96.7) “…on a stated day they had been accustomed to meet before daybreak and to recite a hymn among themselves to Christ, as though he were a god
Clearly, early Christians thought that the creator had come down from heaven.
BTTT - I used to be a regular pioneer and enjoyed defending WT doctrines with people I met at the doors. I thought I was pretty effective. But, looking back - if someone had presented me with all these scriptures as a list at one time, it would have really shocked the Gibbering Body out of me!
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38
New Approach to Discussing Deity of Christ with JW's
by Sea Breeze in5:27; 9:59; 18:22; jn.
9:48; [21:8]; 24:47; jn.
21:12, 17;] jn.
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Sea Breeze
Thanks for the completed list Vanderhoven7
The Traditional Passages Showing Christ's Deity are probably worth posting on this thread as well: showing that, like the Father, Jesus is...
- Called God: John 1:1 with v. 14; 20:28; Rom. 9:5; Titus 2:13; Heb. 1:8; 2 Pet. 1:1; Luke 1:16-17
- From Everlasting: Ps. 90:2 with Micah 5:2
- Receiving worship: Mat. 2:11; 14:33; 28:9; John 9:38; Heb. 1:6 (etc., 10x) with Ex. 34:14; Acts 10:25-26 & Rev. 19:10
- Forgiving/Delegating Power to Forgive: Mat. 6:9, 12 with Jn. 20:23; Luke 5:20; Mark 2:5-11 & 1 Jn. 1:7-9
- Omniscient: John 10:15; 2:24-25 21:17
- Omnipresent: Ps. 139:7-10 with Mat. 18:20 & 28:20
- Omnipotent: Rev. 1:8 with 11-13, 17; 2:8; 5:11-6:1, 21:22-23; & 22:13
- Immutable: Mal. 3:6 with Hebrews 13:8
- The exact equivalent
in nature: Heb. 1:3; Phil 2:6 doesn't rob the Father to see Christ as His equal
in fullness: Col. 2:9 (in Christ "dwells all the fullness of the Godhead")
in glory: Isa. 45:25 with Gal. 6:14 and John 1:14; etc.
to whom every knee shalll bow: Isa. 45:23 with Phil. 2:10
to whom every tongue shall confess: Isa. 45:23 with Phil. 2:11 and Rom. 14:10-11
as the Almighty: Rev. 1:8 with 11-13, 17; 2:8; 5:11-6:1, 21:22-23; & 22:13
as Creator: Isa. 45:5-7, 18 with John 1:3 and Col. 1:16-17
as Savior: Isa. 45:21 and Luke 1:47 with Titus 3:6; 2:13; 2 Pet. 1:11; 1 John 4:14
as searcher of hearts: Ps. 139:23-24 with John 2:24-25 & Rev. 2:18-19, 23
as possessor of the everlasting kingdom: Dan. 7:13-14
as King of Kings: Rev. 19:16 with Dan. 2:47 and Isa. 33:22
as Lawgiver: James 4:12
as Judge: Ps. 9:7-8; 50:6 & 75:7; Isa. 33:22; 66:16; Heb. 12:23 with John 5:22; Acts 10:42; 17:31; Rom. 2:16; 2 Cor. 5:10; 2 Tim. 4:1, 8
as Jehovah: Isa. 40:3 with Mat. 3:3; and Isa. 8:13-14 with 1 Pet. 2:7-8; Mat. 21:42; Mk. 12:10. -
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New Approach to Discussing Deity of Christ with JW's
by Sea Breeze in5:27; 9:59; 18:22; jn.
9:48; [21:8]; 24:47; jn.
21:12, 17;] jn.
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Sea Breeze
What's unclear about "the father is greater than I"?
UBERWitless, that's a socalled "proof scripture" that the WT uses.
Nothing unclear about that verse you cited. Also perfectly clear is that Jesus possesses "all power in heaven and earth" - Mt. 28: 18
Also, equally clear is that Jesus said he would resurrect himself while he was dead. - John 10:18
The problem is that the fundamental assumption of the WT is materialism [sort of]. They deny that personhood is attributed to someone's spirit or soul in the bible. Then, they use this false assumption to harp on some scriptures while denying others.And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. - 1 Thess. 5: 23
Since we are Tri--Partite beings with personhood attributed to each, according to many scriptural proofs, it is easy to see where Jesus at times spoke from his flesh as the son of Mary, and at other times from his spirit [the very essence of God] as the son of God.
Jesus referred to himself as both the son of God and the son of man. He was both - indivisible essence of God in spirit joined to a fully functioning physical human body.
Bottom line is that if the bible teaches that Jesus was both God and man, that should be the official Christian position, regardless of whether or not we accept it or if we fully understand it.